I spent some time today comparing my two Rumours CDs—the JP for US pre-target Sanyo pressing versus the CD-layer of the Warner SACD. Below are described both: Warner 3010-2 Label: MADE IN JAPAN (radial at 6 o'clock w/ target spacing) Pressing: Sanyo, JP (1983-???) Pressing date: 1984 Matrix: 3010-2 412033 Barcode: none DR: 14 Peak Levels: 50.5 / 41.7 / 28.7 / 38.1 / 40.6 / 18.2 / 51.0 / 40.5 / 45.3 / 48.5 / 54.3 CUETools ID: BwIGCw67vzz8hO09AczSL2L2sZE- Warner WPCR-14171 Label: Made in Japan; Manufactured and distributed by Warner Music Japan, Inc. Pressing: DADC JP (1999-current) Pressing date: 2011 Matrix: WPCR-14171 HD 2, WPCR-14171 CD 1 Barcode: 4943674108947 DR: 11 Peak Levels: 94.0 / 100.0 / 99.3 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 100.0 / 96.6 CUETools ID: Iw..DZIKmBvUFiAF2ByIDyXfzc0- While this thread is a discussion regarding Target CDs with different masterings, I thought I’d include a sound comparison (IMHO) between the pre-target and a recent pressing of a SACD CD layer. Please note that as far as I can tell the pre-target Sanyo pressings are similar, if not identical to the Sanyo Target pressings. Summarized below are the some EAC peak values: Sanyo JP Pre-Target: 50.5 / 41.7 / 28.7 / 38.1 / 40.6 / 18.2 / 51.0 / 40.5 / 45.3 / 48.5 / 54.3 Sanyo JP Target: 50.5 / 41.7 / 28.7 / 38.1 / 40.6 / 18.2 / 51.0 / 40.5 / 45.3 / 48.5 / 54.3 PolyGram WG Target (01 matrix): 89.8 / 83.4 / 57.5 / 76.2 / 81.2 / 36.5 / 90.7 / 81.0 / 91.7 / 97.0 / 94.3 PolyGram WG Target (04 matrix): 71.1 / 82.3 / 52.5 / 78.0 / 76.2 / 32.1 / 81.2 / 69.2 / 91.3 / 76.0 / 51.5 PDO (RCA) US for US: 71.1 / 82.3 / 52.5 / 78.0 / 76.2 / 32.1 / 81.2 / 69.2 / 91.3 / 76.0 / 51.5 I recently purchased the Sanyo JP pre-target at a price lower than the cost of the 2011 SACD and while the label side of the CD was mint, the underside had numerous highly visible scratches—not something I would normally purchase. Despite the pre-target being in sad condition, it ripped accurately without errors. I had read in multiple SH threads that the Sanyo Target sounded good, so I did a quick comparison. I ended up liking the pre-target much more than the SACD, frankly (IMO), Warner in 20 plus years did not improve the quality of the original JP CD with the SACD CD layer. The pre-target had great dynamic range, nice fade-ins on the songs, some tape hiss at the end on Songbird, nice channel separation, and for me a great overall sound.
Today I have found the WG Target CD with thr o1-matrix in the bins. Haven't yet listened to it bu after glancing once again through ti thread it - soret of - made my day
Here's an interesting finding that I did not expect. I just obtained what I would presume is an early DADC release of Rumours, with "Made In USA - Digital Audio Disc Corp" impressed in the inner ring and DIDX 470 3 in the matrix. As a presumptive early DADC release, I had assumed it would be identical to what you have reported but instead possesses mastering that, I believe, shows up on later releases and is not all that liked. It's peak levels all top out at 100%, except for track 6, Songbird, whose peak is 72%. So my question, then, is this likely the first showing of this mastering, which is generally alluded to as the RE-2? And about when did it appear? No date presents on my disc, but the Digital Audio Disc Corp impression suggests to me it is a mid 80s release. The item (3010-2) also does not have a bar code. Any thoughts from any one . Thanks.
Going from my memory of discussion in this and other threads, the earlier CDs have a sound that has been called “laid back” in a way similar to the original vinyl. There are two distinct mixes among the early CD pressings (described in posts like this one), and I think you will get different opinions on which “sounds like the album as it was originally mixed”. (Somewhere, in another thread, I think even Steve opines on this question.)
I would agree, my early CD’s, Japan for US Sanyo and US Sanyo with the earliest mastering have a laid back presentation. Thank you to @princesskiki (who has written a lot about it on the forum) and to @c-eling for their help. Without them, I wouldn’t be enjoying this album like I do now.
this has been catching my attention because (and idk if there are threads on this type of thing) but i notice more and more remasters of past albums are either slightly sped up or slowed down. here is my comparison of Dreams between the 1984 WG Target and 2013 US remaster
That’s an interesting example for sure, but is it really a trend? I would love to see a thread on that topic if there are more examples.
So, if I was looking for an affordable cd with a mastering similar to the Target 01, and with the 5.01 GDW, it’s a Columbia House version I need? There are a few different versions on discogs, so I’m assuming they don’t sound the same? I’m looking for an affordable version that has no shortened tracks. Time to upgrade from the 2004 I have.
If you want the original mastering from the original mix, Sanyo and West German polygram 01 Matrix are the only options. Of those Sanyo USA which was released by Columbia House would be the most affordable.
@princesskiki, is there any chance you’d be able to provide me a link to that particular Columbia House cd? Searching through discogs, and I can’t find any mention of Sanyo USA with the Columbia House versions - or are they all the same mastering?
Here you go: Fleetwood Mac - Rumours ONLY the Sanyo USA CD pressing by Columbia House is the same mastering. All other CD pressings by Columbia House (except for Cinram, which I can't remember right now) are from a different mastering and/or later mix.
I found mine locally a few years ago, so they are out there. When flipping through the used discs the spine will have the W2-3010 which indicates a Columbia House Club, just make sure the CD Face has Made In U.S.A By Sanyo on it. There's probably sellers on the bay that have no clue of what they have. You'd have to sift through a ton of pictures if they provided good ones.
Not sure if this is relevant, but GDW on the CD linked above is not 5.01 long. I have a Sanyo Japan Target 3010-2, on which GDW is 5.01. I’ve long been satisfied with flipping between that CD and a West German Target I also acquired some time back, on which GDW is 4.52 though if memory serves me includes the smashing glass which I also really like whereas I don’t think that’s in the other one. I’m going to be re listening to much of my Mac collection over the coming weeks, partly as a personal tribute to Christine’s recent passing, and I know it’s going to be a bit like opening a can of worms because there are so many variations of Rumours that it’s hard to resist seeking out more. So still following this thread with interest.
Whomever submitted that info probably carried over other tracktimes from other submissions. Happens quite often.
Hi. I wrote this post on another thread (i.e., for a slightly different reason) but you will find most of the information on Rumours on CD: https://forums.stevehoffman.tv/thre...tions-here-part-22.325527/page-6#post-9306406 I know I wrote a more comprehensive post somewhere else but I cannot remember whether it was on a Music Corner thread, a private conversation (PM), or on a For Sale (FS thread.
I would be interesting to compare "Go Your Own Way" on all of these discs with our host's version on Legends: Get It On (AF SACD sampler).
I am guessing your posts have already helped me chose several of my Rumours CDs, in which case many thanks!!!! (Re)Reading your post from the other thread, I have a black “target “ printed Sanyo Japan CD with "60412I" in the matrix (full matrix reads: 3010-2 60412I MANUFACTURED BY SANYO JAPAN”) with GDW 5.01 and lots of prominent howling. From your detailed analysis of the different CDs with this mastering I now know it likely dates ’84-6. I also have a West German Polygram red “target” CD, with “7599 03010-2 2893 013 04 ET” and what looks like inverted “JG” in the matrix, with a shorter version of GDW, minus the howling but with smashing glass. Both CDs sound very like my old vinyl Rumours. The Sanyo is noticeably quieter. If I had to pick a favourite it’d probably be the version with breaking glass in GDW, for that reason. However it’s a close call, as I also really like the howling…. I picked up both CDs from eBay several years ago, having read threads like these. I can’t remember how much I paid unfortunately but they were reasonable and they are both in good but used condition and play perfectly. The respective sellers knew what they were selling, IIRC. This forum helped me figure out what to look for. I wish other seekers all the best with their own quests!
Sucks when they do this, especially if you're looking for something that may have mixes, alt versions and they just re-list existing track times from some other manufacture or what not. I added a comment just now fixing this false time.
