Sinatra / Capitol Sound Quality and General Discussion: "Nice 'n' Easy" - 1960*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MLutthans, Jun 19, 2010.

  1. teag

    teag Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    Does the new mix change the vocals at all? Any drier?
     
  2. cornell4

    cornell4 Member

    Location:
    New York
    The new release's vocals are drier but it has been heavily noise reduced and has poor tonality compared to many releases from the original mix.
     
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  3. Simon A

    Simon A Arrr!

    This is your conclusion after hearing which format?
     
  4. cornell4

    cornell4 Member

    Location:
    New York
    iTunes and Spotify (I strongly doubt the forthcoming CD will be free of NR and EQ'd differently).

    I'd be happy to share an original sample for mlutthans's excellent Sinatra resource web site (reel to reel on Teac A-6100 and Lavry ADC). May not be the top sonic choice but I'm a fan and owner of many of the Capitol/Reprise reel to reel tapes, especially ZD-17 Where Are You.

    For example, listen to the instrumental section starting at 2:55 of "You Go To My Head." The flute, strings, and drums sound noticeably clouded.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2020
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  5. David m bond

    David m bond Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    As I mentioned in the other Nice n Easy thread Bob linked to above, I think this is more midrangey but the vocals no longer have that harsh sound as on the Mfsl.

    This may end up being my goto version.

    @Bob F should I post my review in here instead of the other thread. Not always sure I put stuff in the correct thread. Thanks
     
  6. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Either thread would be okay. I would post here and drop a link to your review in the other thread. Or vice-versa. :)
     
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  7. David m bond

    David m bond Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    My review from the other thread

    Sinatra album Nice 'n' Easy. Thoughts?
     
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  8. hodgo

    hodgo Tea Making Gort (Yorkshire Branch) Staff

    Location:
    East Yorkshire
    I've finally got around to buying a copy of the recent expanded edition of "Nice 'n' Easy yesterday. I have to say as with all modern Sinatra releases I wasn't expecting much, so imagine my surprise to find how enjoyable this new mix is. Yes the orchestra is more dominant in the mix than previously, but this takes nothing away from Frank's vocals which as pointed out by others are also less harsh, there is also a warmer overall sound that I like a lot, so much so I can see myself returning to this CD often.
     
  9. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Interesting tidbits on the tape box photo that is under the CD tray of the 2020 remix edition:
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Box FullSHTV.jpg
    This may be the most intriguing part:
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Box NewAdd.jpg
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Credits2.jpg
    So....the song "Nice 'n' Easy" has a mark in red ink, "NEW ENDING 5-4-60," while the bottom of the box indicates that "Proof Ref" (reference lacquers for final approval) were made on 5-2-60, then NEW proof refs were cut on 5-5-60, so something got changed between May 2 and May 4, requiring a re-cut of the proof ref approval lacquers?

    Also: "ML-WT" -- Maurice Long and Wally Traugott? In 1960? Or were other guys there with the same initials? (Don't trust those guys with ML initials.....)

    Also, note the presence of the familiar 1417 catalog number, plus the circa 1980 SN-series release:
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Box SN mark.jpg

    Hugh Davies did the transfer. Does that imply that he did the three-track to two-track mixdown? I'm not sure what the nomenclature was for the different steps at that time.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2020
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  10. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    I'm not sure what this one means:
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Box A.jpg
    "Re 300 @ 19 LX70"
    ??????

    LX70 *may* indicate low-frequency crossover (blend) at 70 Hz....maybe. In other words, all bass below 70 Hz goes to the center, for ease of disk cutting. That would not surprise me.

    This similar note appears higher up on the box:
    Sinatra Nice 'n' Easy Tape Box 1300.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2020
  11. rangerjohn

    rangerjohn Forum Resident

    Location:
    chicago, il
    :p
     
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  12. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Perhaps they were originally going to use Mr. S's "non-PC" coda on "Nice n' Easy" but thought better of it? Just a guess.
     
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  13. MMM

    MMM Forum Hall Of Fame

    Location:
    Lodi, New Jersey
    I see it saying RL...
     
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  14. Alex Zabotkin

    Alex Zabotkin Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pepperland
    300 max LPI, 19 μm basic groove depth maybe?
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2020
  15. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    The 18 and 19 in those photos could also be "land" settings (the space between the lines/groove). 19 μm land with 2-1/4 mil groove gets about 390 LPI (which is the original, 1960 LPI setting shown nearer the top of the box -- *possibly* with the "2.5" mark indicating a 2.5 mil groove). Dunno for sure! I think that "VP gain" *may* indicate an intentional overdrive of the preview head by 2 dB to avoid (pre-computer assist) getting overcuts (grooves colliding) or liftouts (loss of depth as phase changes) with the fairly tight groove spacing. Not sure, though, and I was not there in 1960! Some of the notations are undoubtedly "gear specific," and whatever gear was in the loop is long gone, leading to revisions over the years. For instance, starting in the late 60s, Capitol went from all-Scully to a mix of Scully and Neumann lathes. (I would not rule out the unclear "RI" or Re" notations being "Revision 1" and "Revision 2" as gear got swapped out, tastes changed [limiting removed/reduced] over the decades, etc.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2020
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  16. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    Technical stuff aside, I still think it's fascinating that the contents of side one got changed between May 2 and May 4, 1960. I'd love to know exactly what got rejected! I think @paulmock may be on the right track.
     
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  17. paulmock

    paulmock Forum Resident

    Location:
    Hollywood, CA
    Mr. S may not have been recording much in 1960, but he sure was ACTIVE! Top Male Actor in movie polls...just had "Ocean's 11" and "Can-can" and was about to head to Hawaii for exteriors for "Devil at 4 o'Clock" and some JFK campaigning. They were all still glowing in the success of "The Summit" from January. He had a very successful TV series currently running. And to top it off there was Nice n' Easy and Swingin' Session! along with some very successful singles getting much airplay. And yes I say again JFK campaigning amongst the "creme de la cream" of the Democratic party. There is where a possible flag was raised. Leave us not forget that Dean's famous "Ain't That a Kick in the Head" which was released in early August and was actually banned from some radio stations due to controversial lyrics, ("She's picked out a king sized bed"?????). Just maybe maybe maybe someone of authority thought that, fun though it may be, Mr. S's bad boy image using a coda the likes of "Just put your hand on it, baby" in a very soft, seductive way was abit too much for some voters in sweet & innocent 1960.

    This is just one fan's/man's very long-winded explanation as to why there was this early May edit to "Nice n' Easy". Don't blame me...blame @MLutthans for being a super sleuth and pointing that out in the 1st place. :evil:
     
  18. zoltantamas

    zoltantamas Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Slovakia
    Hi! Sorry if asking already answered, but is it known why the MFSL issue from 2008 has "new artwork" for back cover and gatefold? I really don't like it, and I am curious whose idea was it? Am I only who don't like it? :D Also what is written in the inside liner notes? Thank you very much! :)
     
  19. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Contractually, MFSL was required to duplicate the Capitol CD artwork and liner notes (EOTC version from 2002). Blame the Capitol lawyers. Images are viewable at Discogs:

    Frank Sinatra - Nice 'N' Easy (2002, CD) Capitol
    Frank Sinatra - Nice 'N' Easy (2008, Gold Disc, Mini-LP Sleeve, Gatefold, CD) MFSL
    Frank Sinatra - Nice 'N' Easy (2009, 180g, Vinyl) MFSL
     
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  20. McLover

    McLover Senior Member

    Location:
    Athens, Tennessee
    I wish all the world could be "Norberg Free". We'd have more music instead of murky mush disguised as music.
     
  21. zoltantamas

    zoltantamas Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Slovakia
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  22. Roanoke Park Indefinitely

    Roanoke Park Indefinitely Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Can someone link me that list of Amazon UK links to purchase new copies of the late 80s/early 90s Walsh remasters? It was in a thread on these boards and I cannot find.

    specifically trying to get the 91 Nice N Easy with the bonus tracks. I have the first-run version that only has the 12 tracks and I’m considering upgrading. If someone has a link or the catalog number on this one I’d appreciate it!!
     
  23. MLutthans

    MLutthans That's my spaghetti, Chewbacca! Staff Thread Starter

    There are two "Walsh" CDs of Nice 'n' Easy: a 12-song newly-remixed version from 1988 (fairly hard to find, but apparently the disc you already own), and a version with bonus tracks from 1991. As far as the actual 12 songs that were originally on the Nice 'n' Easy album in 1960, 11 of them are identical on both discs. (In other words, 11 of the 12 original songs use the same 1988 remixes on both the 1988 and 1991 CDs.) For some reason, the title track received a new remix for the 1991 release, while the other 11 tracks from the original album did not, and just carried over the remixes/masterings used on the 1988 CD. In my opinion, the 1991 mix is superior to the 1988 remix of the title song, so I recommend finding that disc over the 1988 version....but only for the one remix and the bonus tracks, so you may or may not want to bother taking the plunge, as 11 of the 12 tracks you already have will be exactly duplicated on the 1991 disc.

    I *think* this is the one, but I don't have my copy handy to confirm the number.
    https://www.amazon.co.uk/Nice-N-Eas...ds=sinatra+nice+easy+cd&qid=1611721138&sr=8-1

    Calling @Bob F !
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2021
  24. Bob F

    Bob F Senior Member

    Walsh-mastered Sinatra CDs in the UK (post #13)
    Frank Sinatra - Best Sounding CDs? (post #185)
    Sinatra / Capitol U.S. CD Catalog Numbers (post #205)

    Yes, that is the correct link to the 1991 16-track version available new in the UK:

    Nice 'N' Easy: Amazon.co.uk: Music
     
  25. Roanoke Park Indefinitely

    Roanoke Park Indefinitely Forum Resident

    Location:
    Los Angeles
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